Just to abuse my privilege as a subscriber for a moment....
As time goes on, I find Pope Francis in these moves as w/ Carinal Burke being foolish, and I understand not wanting to involve women in the Church "management" in meaningful ways... especially middle-aged and older laywomen.
Because we would say: don't be a bitch. It's not a good look.
I do pray for the Pope, especially that the Holy Spirit brings him wisdom. To be sure, there are probably many things he does that are good & wise, and we don't necessarily hear about it, as it's not considered newsworthy. I generally distrust media coverage of Popes (whoever it happens to be), and not only because the original wasn't in English.
In the big picture, a petty snipe at a cardinal is minor. But I only hear about Popes, cardinals, and bishops trying to avoid responsibility for things they do have responsibility for, and wasting time on crap that they have no expertise in and thereby making themselves look fools, and then worse, commenting on stuff they could comment on and then making us look evil (example: Israel).
You make a good point about Pope Francis' tendency to eclipse his own message with needless distractions. He seems to be very emotional in his decision making, and in his statements, and it gets in the way.
Thanks for getting to the point toward the end--the small problem is the divisiveness of the Pope's pettiness and the large problem is the Pope squandering his authority on little things and avoiding the big things that seem obvious to all. The role of a leader is to communicate the vision of the organization he leads--the ten-second elevator speech is a good start.
"preach the word [as an official messenger]; be ready when the time is right and even when it is not [keep your sense of urgency, whether the opportunity seems favorable or unfavorable, whether convenient or inconvenient, whether welcome or unwelcome]; correct [those who err in doctrine or behavior], warn [those who sin], exhort and encourage [those who are growing toward spiritual maturity], with inexhaustible patience and [faithful] teaching." 2 Tim 3:10 Amplified Bible translation
I thought this was a great discussion, particularly at the end, about unity in the Church, and what the Pope can do to effect it. I think Ed is absolutely right to be frustrated by the Pope missing the forest for the trees in taking away Cardinal Burke’s apartment but not doing much at all while the Church in Germany proceeds full-steam ahead towards schism, and I share that frustration. But I wonder if Pope Francis is also frustrated by his lack of control over the German Church and their refusal to listen to him, and is taking that out on Cardinal Burke — he can’t fix the big disunifying issue, but he can actually do something about this much smaller issue plaguing him (to his way of thinking). That absolutely doesn’t make it right, and it could have been done in a much more charitable, less antagonistic way, but I think maybe Pope Francis wanted a “win” and Cardinal Burke was an easy target.
As JD pointed out in the Tuesday Pillar post (and I wish you would have talked about a bit in this episode), this might have the opposite long-term effect than what Pope Francis hoped for or intended. I thought the discussion about how various recent popes have shaped the College of Cardinals was really interesting, about varying levels of tolerance (true tolerance, not how that word is often used today) for disagreement or even opposition.
The host seems to scoff at the idea of a good death, but this interview with Shane's widow touches on his last moments. I think it was sweet that he was in the habit of praying for everyone but himself. I can't assert he was truly a practicing Catholic based on her testimony, but I do think he loved his neighbor. https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/22328585/
To add a much less substantive comment after this very helpful discussion, I agree with Ed that it is unseemly to search Zillow for the value of someone's house before a visit to it. Perhaps for the first time in my life, I'm inclined to call something "gauche." I know property sales are a matter of public record, but still... Ick.
Oh, it's totally gauche to Zillow someone's house. But I'll admit that I do it. The difference between me and a lot of other people is that I admit it.
And to be clear, I'm not principally interested in the value. I like to know where the bathrooms are.
I know who the Pogues are but I needed a reminder about who this Austin Ivory guy is. In my opinion he should sit back, be a medieval peasant, ignore gossip (even, or especially, if it is about someone you care about), do not be an important person on social media, definitely do not angle for a Theoden/Grima spokesperson relationship because that's just creepy, and do offer one's sufferings today for the Pope.
“Plastic American paddyism”. DAMN! I had no idea there was a name for it and ouch! More caustic Ed!
We’ve been playing the Pogues joyfully. They are not sad songs really, they have that indescribably quality of Irish hope in something better to come even as everything goes to shit and there won’t be a happy ending for this life. Happy endings are for the Disney channel and philistines. May you enjoy you’re eternal reward Shane and maybe see if you can do something about Sinead O’Conner.
Fellas, sloooooww doooown, please! I'm a native English speaker and not exactly elderly, and yet I struggled to keep up with your sometimes impressive demonstration of rapid alliteration. It's a shame, because I'm pretty sure there was some interesting conversation in there.
Just to abuse my privilege as a subscriber for a moment....
As time goes on, I find Pope Francis in these moves as w/ Carinal Burke being foolish, and I understand not wanting to involve women in the Church "management" in meaningful ways... especially middle-aged and older laywomen.
Because we would say: don't be a bitch. It's not a good look.
I do pray for the Pope, especially that the Holy Spirit brings him wisdom. To be sure, there are probably many things he does that are good & wise, and we don't necessarily hear about it, as it's not considered newsworthy. I generally distrust media coverage of Popes (whoever it happens to be), and not only because the original wasn't in English.
In the big picture, a petty snipe at a cardinal is minor. But I only hear about Popes, cardinals, and bishops trying to avoid responsibility for things they do have responsibility for, and wasting time on crap that they have no expertise in and thereby making themselves look fools, and then worse, commenting on stuff they could comment on and then making us look evil (example: Israel).
Come, Holy Spirit!
And to unabuse my privilege -- I've been dedicating some of my rosary intentions to JD, Ed, & the Pillar!
Love y'all's work! Keep at it!
You make a good point about Pope Francis' tendency to eclipse his own message with needless distractions. He seems to be very emotional in his decision making, and in his statements, and it gets in the way.
Thanks for getting to the point toward the end--the small problem is the divisiveness of the Pope's pettiness and the large problem is the Pope squandering his authority on little things and avoiding the big things that seem obvious to all. The role of a leader is to communicate the vision of the organization he leads--the ten-second elevator speech is a good start.
"preach the word [as an official messenger]; be ready when the time is right and even when it is not [keep your sense of urgency, whether the opportunity seems favorable or unfavorable, whether convenient or inconvenient, whether welcome or unwelcome]; correct [those who err in doctrine or behavior], warn [those who sin], exhort and encourage [those who are growing toward spiritual maturity], with inexhaustible patience and [faithful] teaching." 2 Tim 3:10 Amplified Bible translation
I thought this was a great discussion, particularly at the end, about unity in the Church, and what the Pope can do to effect it. I think Ed is absolutely right to be frustrated by the Pope missing the forest for the trees in taking away Cardinal Burke’s apartment but not doing much at all while the Church in Germany proceeds full-steam ahead towards schism, and I share that frustration. But I wonder if Pope Francis is also frustrated by his lack of control over the German Church and their refusal to listen to him, and is taking that out on Cardinal Burke — he can’t fix the big disunifying issue, but he can actually do something about this much smaller issue plaguing him (to his way of thinking). That absolutely doesn’t make it right, and it could have been done in a much more charitable, less antagonistic way, but I think maybe Pope Francis wanted a “win” and Cardinal Burke was an easy target.
As JD pointed out in the Tuesday Pillar post (and I wish you would have talked about a bit in this episode), this might have the opposite long-term effect than what Pope Francis hoped for or intended. I thought the discussion about how various recent popes have shaped the College of Cardinals was really interesting, about varying levels of tolerance (true tolerance, not how that word is often used today) for disagreement or even opposition.
Disclosure: "Caustic Ed" is indeed a fan favorite! But I also love JD's teflon-grade cheerfulness and self-deprecation. :)
This all appears petty.
Silencing dissent or disagreement by removal of privileges always backfires.
And yet, we have canon 1404, "The First See is judged by no one."
Where is Christian freedom or the Pauline rebuke (Gal 2, 11-21) in this?
I know, today we live in different times and the papacy has "developed" since then but is there such a thing as loyal opposition?
Certainly, the papal office and the holder should be respected but can no one ask for answers or reasoning for papal actions?
I was comforted to learn Shane MacGowan received last rites. He was a a complex and beautiful soul, from what I could observe.
The host seems to scoff at the idea of a good death, but this interview with Shane's widow touches on his last moments. I think it was sweet that he was in the habit of praying for everyone but himself. I can't assert he was truly a practicing Catholic based on her testimony, but I do think he loved his neighbor. https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/22328585/
To add a much less substantive comment after this very helpful discussion, I agree with Ed that it is unseemly to search Zillow for the value of someone's house before a visit to it. Perhaps for the first time in my life, I'm inclined to call something "gauche." I know property sales are a matter of public record, but still... Ick.
Agreed, I had a legit double-take there. That's... just not something one does.
Oh, it's totally gauche to Zillow someone's house. But I'll admit that I do it. The difference between me and a lot of other people is that I admit it.
And to be clear, I'm not principally interested in the value. I like to know where the bathrooms are.
I know who the Pogues are but I needed a reminder about who this Austin Ivory guy is. In my opinion he should sit back, be a medieval peasant, ignore gossip (even, or especially, if it is about someone you care about), do not be an important person on social media, definitely do not angle for a Theoden/Grima spokesperson relationship because that's just creepy, and do offer one's sufferings today for the Pope.
A minor point of correction, for those who haven't heard of him before, his last name is Ivereigh, not Ivory.
“Plastic American paddyism”. DAMN! I had no idea there was a name for it and ouch! More caustic Ed!
We’ve been playing the Pogues joyfully. They are not sad songs really, they have that indescribably quality of Irish hope in something better to come even as everything goes to shit and there won’t be a happy ending for this life. Happy endings are for the Disney channel and philistines. May you enjoy you’re eternal reward Shane and maybe see if you can do something about Sinead O’Conner.
Fellas, sloooooww doooown, please! I'm a native English speaker and not exactly elderly, and yet I struggled to keep up with your sometimes impressive demonstration of rapid alliteration. It's a shame, because I'm pretty sure there was some interesting conversation in there.
Hi, what's the going rate to sponsor a Pillar podcast episode? Please feel free to email me. Thanks!
(I couldn't find a "Contact Us" button, and anytime I've replied to the T/F newsletters I've never gotten an answer.)
please email me at jdflynn AT pillarcatholic DOT com